Umineko No Naku Koro Ni - Discussion

One thing I’ve been thinking about, is how Umineko thrives in the VN and Manga formats, but doesn’t do so well in Animation.

The thing I’ve noticed is Umineko has a weird sense of time (especially in the later arcs). When you start getting into truth-battles with swords and stakes, time starts flowing in a weird way that makes more sense in writing than it does in action. For example, (Chiru) we have Dlanor with her red and blue keys. Every time she makes a strike, she recites a blue or red truth. These battles are described to us as super-high-speed action, but if you took that to reality, it’d appear like they’re moving in super slow motion :stuck_out_tongue:

Just a thought I’ve had. It’d be very hard to faithfully recreate Umineko Chiru into Anime (or live action).

Oooh, the topic is back!
I have to say I disagree with you on this one, Aspirety. I actually think Umineko would make an amazing animation work, even with some details (such as those you mentioned) needing a bit more liberty to be adapted. Hell, I was pretty much imagining in my mind how well it could be animated while reading the whole thing.
It’s just that Deen and particular screwed up. I don’t think the anime was outright bad, far from it, but it undeniably failed to convey the actual “spirit” of the VN, so to speak. Also, a bit rushed for its own good.
If ufotable did a similar treatment to what they did to Kara no Kyoukai, for example, I’m pretty sure it would turn out great. And hey, why not dream, right? They already managed to snatch Fate/Stay Night’s animation rights from Deen anyway.

I’ve always thought that Umineko would much better suit a movie series format than a TV series one. A movie per episode would be fantastic.

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Yeah, I can’t imagine liking Umineko nearly as much if it wasn’t released in a serial format (I joined once EP5 came out). I usually tell people to wait a week or so after completing EP2, 3, 4, 5, and 6 so they get at least some of the experience

I really liked the journey of talking with people on AnimeSuki between releases. Compared to Higurashi where I really liked reading it in one go.

I think the movie idea would be great!! Too bad the anime already ruined half of it :confused:

Hey, sounds like you had a very similar experience to me! I joined around when EP5 was released too, and really got into the Animesuki discussion around EP6.

Well I just started rereading this novel. In hindsight, I can’t even really say I’ve finished reading it yet. Going through it all over once more suddenly feels like it’s a part of reading Umineko in the first place ^^

Still using the old sprites and voiceless version. I don’t think I could get used to the change.

yeah I could never get used to the update patch, the original sprites are charming and expressive

and while the character voices are AMAZING, the music is even more amazing and the overlay messes with the epic scenes :frowning:

EDIT: Also, the beginning of EP2 makes me want to cry now :frowning:

I actually always opt to read a VN without voices most of the time. I think it kinda helps in the “book-like” mood. Also, even though I still consume a lot of japanese geek culture, I’m getting kinda tired of Japanese voice-acting. Most of the female and infant characters kinda sound the same (very high-pitched), and a lot of times the acting can be over-dramatic and corny as hell. I just couldn’t really enjoy Remember11, for an example, with the voices. So I don’t really care if they added voice acting to the ps3 version and subsequent pc patch, since I’ll never really use it.

One thing I can’t help but disagree is with the visual update. It just looks MUCH better to me, hands down. The original sprites were expressive, but I still think they were pretty bad no matter how you looked at it. Sure, after a short while you do get used to it as you get invested in the story, and the fact that the soundtrack is just phenomenal also helped me overlook the visuasl. But the PS3 visuals? Damn, I think the art looks just awesome.

Also, actual event CGs are a very nice plus.

So I just wrote this up in an attempt to establish a basis for people to create their own Umineko Gameboards to challenge others with. I’m interested to hear people’s thoughts.

I’d really love to create a game of my own sometime in the future.

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The manga definitely confirmed Yasu=Shannon=Kanon and the Yasu birth sex as a male.

A friend and I established a working system for creating Umineko gameboards, and we used them to roleplay against each other. (Basically exactly what you said.) The model we used is “logic game 1v1 with assistant roles.”

Sadly due to his inactivity we couldn’t finish, but I think the framework is pretty solid. (We made this around EP6 or EP7 release IIRC)

http://www.gaiaonline.com/forum/series-related-miscellaneous-role-play/umineko-no-naku-koro-ni-episode-a/t.66370011/ is the game he made. This one is legit Umineko-tier. He got me big time. (He eventually told me the solution and I wanted to beat the shit out of him)

http://www.gaiaonline.com/forum/series-related-miscellaneous-role-play/umineko-no-naku-koro-ni-episode-b/t.70447329/ is the game I made. He got pretty close, but he didn’t have enough love 8)

(In particular, the EPA rules work pretty well, but you might want to mold them based on your vision.)

Basically there are 4 roles: The Detective, the Witch, the Impartial Judge, and the Watson. The detective and the witch basically play in Umineko fashion, pretty easy. The Watson is there to act as an assistant to the detective. The Impartial Judge receives a copy of the Witch’s solution is and there to make sure the Witch doesn’t violate any reds. (The solution is allowed to contain contingencies, a la EP6.)

The Witch controls all the non-detective pieces and molds the story. The Detective controls both the Game-Piece Detective and the Meta-Detective and is allowed to ask questions, but the Witch ultimately forces the events on the gameboard. (No bullshit duct-taping doors basically.)

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Also, I would love to play if you ever host a game :slight_smile:

I love the idea of including assistants and judges. I think that’s something I neglected to suggest in my post.

The idea that only two people are needed to make the game work is pretty naive, especially with all the variables floating around. At the very least, you need a judge or judges to make sure the gameboard is solid, and call the GM up on any violations. Without it, the game could end up a disaster.

Strictly speaking you could operate on a trust system within the game and keep it 1v1, I don’t think the GM would try to cheat, considering how easy it would be to call them out at the conclusion of the game. But it takes the stress off him a little to know that there are people whose job it is to make sure he doesn’t screw up.

At the very least the GM would want to confer with somebody about his own scenario for proofreading purposes.

EDIT: I mention the first part because I was worried when I was playing that the “judge” role might be unfulfilling… they pretty much sit and watch the 2 main characters, and occasionally troll if they want to. But most of the action happens between 2 people in this model.

One thing we considered was having a separate HIDDEN “Tea Party” subforum where any non-detective characters could discuss the game while it’s happening. So you could laugh at the incompetent detective while he screws up :smile:

My Umineko experience began with the anime, after a friend of mine sent me a link to the opening theme. (Katayoku no Tori is still one of the best opening songs I know.)
I got hooked pretty fast since I like mystery stories. I read some books by Sir Arthur Conan Doyle and Agatha Cristie back in the days. But after the first arc was over, Umineko got magical… and very confusing. My greatest “wtf” moment was the entrance of bunny girls who could fire beams by holding hands.
Even though Umineko remained in my memory as an unfinished confusing mindfuck anime, I never forgot its good parts. So when I found out that the original is a VN, I knew I’d read it one day, which is exactly what I did a few months ago.

I can’t say I enjoyed all of it. The first four episodes were more of a chore than anything since I already knew what would happen. On the other hand, that knowledge granted me a different viewpoint on the events and a slightly more advantageous starting point to close in on the mysteries.
I actually pretty much marathoned the VN. I didn’t make breaks in-between the episodes. Instead, I made txt files where I wrote down everything that seemed important or suspicious to me, as well as some of my own theories. (I still have those files on my pc.) And I used those notes to ponder about the mysteries while reading. It worked pretty well for me.

I’m not sure what to say about Umineko overall. The concept was amazing. The voicing and OST were among the best I’ve ever heard. The mysteries were really good and there were enough of them to keep you more or less interested all the time.
What rubbed me the wrong way, though, was the length. 8 Episodes were a bit too much. 6 would have been sufficient with better text management. There was just too much text, many passages were repetetive or even downright pointless. So were certain characters, like the two demons of love farce (I give you a trial of love and grant you immortality). Some of the ‘funny’ passages I didn’t find funny at all, they merely broke immersion. I think Ryuukishi needs to work on his comedy placement, because letting things take a ridiculous turn during a life-and-death situation (and then switch back whenever) just ruins everything. I’m referring to the ‘loser flag count’ in… I think it was ep4.

I love philosophy, so I can confidently say I learned some interesting stuff by reading Umineko. Trying to solve the mysteries was fun. I felt a sense of accomplishment whenever I guessed something right, but I sometimes got overwhelmed by the amount of confusion thrown at the reader. Overall, it was certainly a good read.

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Strangely, I thought the Krauss fight was one of the most awesome ones in the series, I might just be weird though :smile:

Read the manga for EP8, it’s waaaaaaaay better and leaves a better taste in your mouth

Has the manga finished in Japan yet?

I’m about to start reading this VN since I saw how much @Aspirety seemed to love it in another thread.

From what Ive gathered, we have a pretty similar tastes, and I’ve been meaning to check out Umineko since a lot of people say this VN is pretty great. (That and I’m looking to find an interest in this franchise since I didn’t really like Higurashi anime all too much, and the author of both wrote Lucia’s route [Rewrite] if I remember correctly)

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Speaking of game boards, there’s actually a subreddit that does something similar. Not exactly a game board, but /r/murdermysterygames has a narrative, followed by Blue/Red truth duels. Though it’s definitely not fast paced lol. And it’s inactive.

It’d be awesome to have a live-action game. It would take time to set up and a lot of interest. The GM would have to be really crafty to predict and make sure the pieces don’t go crazy and ruin everything lol. Still, I’d love to see that someday. Just need players.

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I’d love a game that’s like (Umi 8 spoilers:) the part where Bern/Ryukishi challenges the reader to a game, where you get a story, a set of rules, and a list of statements, and then have to figure everything out, I had so much fun with that that I wanted more

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