Yeah, I get that. But at that point, the “overlapping earth” is ended. It’s already dead. It’s history can no longer be restored. The history of the world that lead to the creation of a “Kazamatsuri” and a “Tennouji Kotarou” is dead. And since all parallel worlds are dead at the time of Moon, all overlapping planes of “Kazamatsuri” are also already non-existent. The world is dead, and “Kazamatsuri” does not exist in any parallel world whatsoever.
Thus, after the occurrences in moon, how was it possible that the earth was restored to a point that it had a “Kazamatsuri” in it? How did all the factors that could have caused a “kazamatsuri” to occur be made to happen in exactly the same way?
I guess I find it hard to wrap my head around because I’m a heavy believer in determinism, and that in order for something to be replicated, all factors that caused it’s creation must be replicated, and all factors that caused those factors must be replicated, and so on.
So did Kagari waste the aurora in the routes? Why didn’t she just simulate the routes, then? After all, her only purpose was to verify if one of those parallel universes would lead to a happy ending for life.
Coincidence, maybe. It’s a fictional work, after all.
Where is it said that Earth is able to create multiple worlds. As far as I’ve read, only the Moon created a “garden” and life on earth only happened once before the Aurora moved.
It’s not the earth that creates paralel universes, aurora does. Right there, in the Memory -> Friends section of rewrite, entry 006 - Kagari (Moon), the one I uploaded a picture of for in this thread, it says:
“If a celestial body has too little surface area and its aurora is too dense, then it ends up creating multiple overlapping worlds.”
It makes no sense for parallel universes to occur anywhere but on earth, and anytime but pre-moon.
At some point in time, there was so much aurora on earth that several alternate universes were created there. The pre-moon routes are examples of those parallel universes. All of those universes had the same conclusion: The death of the earth. The remnants of aurora traveled from the dying earths to the moon and settled there. Moon Kotarou was created with Aurora from his previous alternate counterparts. As proof of that, he retained all memories and skills he had in those worlds.
The garden, too, was most likely created by the aurora remnants of earth (otherwise humanity would have discovered those). The only thing that we know for sure was created by the moon itself was Moon Kagari.
But having the area restriction makes no sense if it also applied to Earth. Why can’t Moon Kotarou just be an amalgamation of all Kotarous from the garden?
You’re not making much sense to me.
There is only one Kotarou in the garden - Moon Kotarou. The ‘previous’ Kotarous were those (including, but not limited to) in the pre-moon routes, which all took place on earth.
But you’re ignoring of fact here. Just look at @Aspirety’s and @Naoki_Saten’s explanations in the Moon Route thread.
Kagari could just make ONE parallel universe during Moon. So, inside Rewrite’s universe there is this possibility, but not in this situation. This is what makes that choice unreasonable.
[quote=“Kaze, post:79, topic:206, full:true”]
I don’t see how you can say it’s a completely different universe that we can’t link to when Rewrite is already dealing with parallel universes. [/quote]
Okay, let me show you how your idea contradicts itself. Let’s say, then, if Rewrite is dealing with parallel universe, any other universe can apply here. But what about a story that there is no such a thing like parallel universes? A story in which parallel universes do not exist. It would be impossible to put those two together.
Even if Rewrite does have parallel universes, it’s still within Rewrite universe. Every piece of fiction has their own rules, world and such. Rewrite is the same.
Ooooookay. So we agree on a lot of stuff. I’ll ask one main question regarding the blueprint:
Are the blueprint experiments real or simulations? If they are real, then that doesn’t make sense in the point of not enough Auorora to create parallel universes, and partially validates my theory. If they are simulations, who’s to say that the routes weren’t also simulations? And by this I mean, how do we distinguish what happened in the real parallel worlds from the simulated parallel worlds? Couldn’t they even be both if an experiment unexpectedly led to essentially the same route?
I guess the hardest thing I’m understanding is the difference between Aurora and “soil” needed. I always thought the blueprints were an insanely dense amount of Aurora, and this is what allows the creation of real parallel worlds as “simulations.” I thought the problem wasn’t the amount of Aurora but the “soil” of Earth from being used by Aurora too much (kind of like recharging a battery too many times - it’s not a problem of electricity (Aurora) but of the battery itself). Can you explain to me the difference between “soil” and Aurora?
As far as I’m concerned, the Earth could never sustain multiple worlds in the first place: it’s too big. Normally the plan when humanity fails is Re-evolution but that can’t be done. I see no problems with the Moon having multiple, “real”, worlds which Kagari uses to find an answer.
Celestial bodies, such as the moon and the earth, are the soil where Aurora can take root. It’s not just the ‘ground’ of those bodies. It’s basically all physical substances that belong to it that can serve as soil. The Kagari (Earth) entry in the memory sectioin explains it quite well, really:
[quote]All living things have at least a tiny amount of aurora in them. Aurora likes to tie itself to physical substances, especially resources which have never been touched by aurora before.
When Aurora reaches other planets (from rockets or meteors or whatever), it has an enoormous quantity of fresh material to work with, so it tends to increase in strength and number rapidly, like bacteria. The farther it spreads, the easier it is for life to appear. You can think of it like flowers and pollen. In other words, this is how planets reproduce. [/quote]
Your comparison to a battery was close, but it didn’t account for Aurora’s capability of multiplying. Of course, the quality of the soil determines how much it can multiply, and how much life can be created. The earth had a crazy amount of different life forms while the moon could only ever produce one creature with its ressources, namely Moon Kagari.
Two factors are responsible for the death of the earth:
Too low amounts of Aurora, which is insufficient for a re-evolution. It can be speculated that the human race is actively wasting Aurora.
Decreasing quality of the earth’s ‘soil’ due to not only its usage by Aurora (Battery comparison), but also misuse by the human race. (Remember how environementalism is a core topic of Rewrite? ^^)
Decreasing quality means that less Aurora can be produced. The human race is gradually destroying the planet and wasting Aurora. But if Salvation happens, the circle of life will be interrupted for good.
This is the situation during Moon route: By the time the soil of the moon will run dry, the soil of earth will recover just enough for one last try at evolution. The dominant race created by that MUST find a solution for the problem. If they don’t, the earth will die again and the Aurora won’t be able to settle on the exhausted Moon either. The absolute end.
That scenario must be avoided at all costs, and a way of life to prosper must be found.
The blueprint experiments are mere simulations. A very detailed theory, a calculation, that has yet to be put into practice. But they’re not the real thing. The term blueprint is pretty accurate here. A blueprint of a house shows how the house should turn out if all implications and calculations are correct. It’s a model that tries to be as accurate and as close to reality as possible. The real house, however, is the thing that is built according to the blueprint. Things that you have not accounted for in the blueprint may become a problem for the house.
The moment when Kagari’s theory, the blueprint, was done was not the moment when the problem was solved completely. She merely made a plan that had yet to be executed. The execution of it is the terra route and its success depends on whether or not it’s executed properly.
Another example of a “real thing” is moon Kotarou.
[quote=“Naoki_Saten, post:43, topic:654”]
Moon Kotarou was created with Aurora from his previous alternate counterparts. As proof of that, he retained all memories and skills he had in those worlds.[/quote]
Imagine him as a house built from parts of other, very similar houses (pre-moon parallel versions of Kotarou). It would make no sense for, say, his supporting pillars to be made out of cut-out paper parts from the blueprint.
Moon Kotarou is made out of real parts and his memories are real as well. They are remnants of real Tennouji Kotarous that went through ‘life’.
If you condense a huge amount of Aurora around the blueprint, all you can get (if at all) would be multiple blueprints that exist on parallel planes. The blueprint would be the only thing with many versions. It would most certainly not result in the creation of huge parallel universes, with an earth, a moon, a solar system and whatnot.
“too big” or “too small” are vague things to say. What matters is the Aurora/surface area ratio. If there is not enough surface area to properly contain the aurora, multiple parallel universes are created in order to contain it.
I am saying that there was a time when the amount of Aurora on earth was so huge that parallel universes were created. That happened way before the story of Rewrite started. It could’ve been millions of years in the past. By the time common route began, multiple universes already existed. On earth. That’s where all pre-moon routes took place.
If parallel worlds were formed on the moon, then again, the moon would be the only thing replicated. There would be multiple moons existing on alternative planes at the exact same spot. To use those for her plan, Kagari would have to “dress up” these moons to look like the earth, atmosphere and all, then reconstruct Kazamatsuri and make sure that its inhabitants never find out that a huge part of the world as they know it doesn’t actually exist.
I’ll say it again:
It makes no sense for parallel universes to occur anywhere but on earth, and anytime but pre-moon.
Once again, I agree with a lot of what you say. Frankly, I don’t have the energy left to continue the discussion at the moment. I’ll say a major point of contention is what the blueprints actually are. I think the blueprints exist in a higher dimension and this allows real parallel universes to exist in it. I totally worded it poorly before, but it’s not that the blueprints use Aurora to create parallel universes but that Aurora’s creation of parallel universes is what created the blueprints. Moon Kagari can then intervene to create her own parallel universes because this is all occurring in a higher dimension.
And so multiple blueprints does result in parallel universes (see my post in Terra thread for a broader picture). But I doubt I will convince you of this, and while I probably won’t budge either, I’ll restate that we really are almost on the same page.
I do wonder how much of this is an issue of translations. IIRC, a couple people criticized the translations for being poor but to my knowledge, they were just being elitist and never gave concrete examples. Even so, I think with a topic this complex, things are going to be lost in translation.
But there is nothing in the game that ever hints at that happening. Am I wrong?
The Moon route is set in a place that looks like Kazamatsuri so there’s no reason the other worlds have to look like the Moon’s surface. There would be no use of the extra worlds if they didn’t have the properties of Earth. As far as “the world as they know it”, if the only world they knew from the start was the Moon then they can’t compare it to anything. “Kotarou” even says while flowing back to Earth that his ego was a part of the theory all along.
You guys are overcomplicating this. And the answers have already been stated multiple times.
The routes of Rewrite are the alternate realities created by the aurora. The Blueprint came about after all those realities reached their end. The blueprint is like a photocopy of all the paths the alternate realities took, and Kagari is trying to find out what little change she can make to create a new possibility for Earth, which is eventually realised in the Terra route. It’s the difference between a person’s life and a person’s diary: you’re merely looking at something that’s already happened and writing footnotes on it to work out a plan for the final world.
I guess I just can’t come to terms with something as powerful and advanced as the blueprints existing at a lower dimension. At a higher dimension, drawing a line on a piece of paper is the equivalent of creating a universe, so it makes sense to me.
I have no clue where your definitions of “dimensions” comes from, but it might be easier to conceptualise the blueprint as a supercomputer. Wait a minute… Wasn’t a supercomputer that can predict everything in common?
Not a supercomputer. It was a programm, created by a previous generation of the Occult club. Akane dug it up and had someone implement it for portable devices, as an app.
It was called La+, hinting at “Laplace’s demon” - a being, or a supercomputer, that, if you fed it enough data (like the position of every atom in the universe), could precisely predict every part of the future through calculations.
Welp, in the end, the name of the program was actually a word play that somehow conained the word “naked”, and it only predicted situations where the user would end up naked.
Yes, it’s probably what you’re thinking right now. Kagari’s blueprint is very close to being a Laplace’s demon.
La+! That’s what I was thinking of.
And yes that’s what I was getting at, the blueprint is very much like laplace’s demon, with the exception of incorporating many worlds instead of one single deterministic outcome.
