But doesn’t that end with (spoiler just in case) Tomoyo dealing with the guys? I meant telling her but also preventing her from taking any action.
(Not a spoiler so quoting as is)
I think it is impossible, at that point, to convince Tomoyo to not do anything about it. Especially considering her hot-blooded personality
But Tomoya didn’t even try, it’s like telling her implied that Tomoya thought that it would be good to ask her for help. I would have really liked an option that goes somewhere in between.
What I don’t like about this is that in my opinion, Tomoya mistakes being able to do things alone with hiding it from everyone. It just feels wrong to hide it from Tomoyo, they should have the confidence to share such things and still plot an intelligent way to deal with the situation, not just hiding the fact that Tomoyo has been challenged and picking fights with everyone every single night.
And this leads to a possible misconception. It could be thought, that to solve problems, you have to be a masochist. You have to withstand all the pain to fix the problem. And it shouldn’t be that way: if there is a way to solve the problem without taking so many risks, I think you should do it that way. And in this case, this way doesn’t revolve around depending on Tomoyo, so Tomoya still would have proven his point of being equally capable without Tomoyo’s help.
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After a long discussion with my older brother about this, I 100% agree.
I discussed the second major theme of this visual novel (Tomoya maturing into a responsible adult who can take care of those closest to him, a very similar arc to the one he went through in After Story), and these are the conclusions he came to. He argued that this arc does not portray this growth as intelligently as After Story did. In the latter, Tomoya grows as a person through practical methods that not only benefit himself and others in the long-term, but none of them are needlessly self-destructive. By taking a job with Yoshino and moving out of the comfort of the Furukawa Bakery, he not only shows he’s self-sufficient, but he’s demonstrating that he’s willing to move out of his comfort zone and show gratitude to the Furukawas for supporting him for so long. He also demonstrates that he’s willing to move on from his past laziness and do the right thing.
But here? Tomoya selfishly asserts that he can deal with a bunch of tough thugs on his own on the pretense of protecting Tomoyo and Tomo, even though the former could deal with the situation all on her own. Just like what you said, he doesn’t even bring up the situation and instead tries to deal with it himself, simply because he feels like he hasn’t earned his spot as Tomoyo’s boyfriend. Isn’t it irresponsible to not tell your girlfriend that she’s in danger immediately? Isn’t it irresponsible to assume you can do this stuff all on your own? Isn’t it irresponsible to pointlessly put your life on the line when you could rationally figure out the best way to solve this? This isn’t Tomoya maturing so much as it is developing a traditional sense of pride in being man. While not necessarily a bad thing, it’s NOT the same as what he learns in After Story. Having pride in what you do, in what you are, is a great motivator to push yourself to be the best you can be, but Tomoya let’s it get in the way of good decision making, and worse, he allows it to make him lie to his girlfriend and hurt himself. If he wanted to take the thugs on his own, so that he could stand on even footing with Tomoyo, fine, but he should, as someone in a relationship, tell Tomoyo that. Explain his feelings so that she understands. Easy? No. Necessary for a healthy relationship? Definitely. But instead, the narrative suggests that Tomoya is totally in the right when choosing to tell Tomoyo results in a bad end that leads to him having no self-esteem and Tomoyo ultimately deciding to quit school. And it simply isn’t right for Tomoya to go without letting the people he’s trying to protect know about it.
This creeps into Tomo’s arc, too. Ultimately, not asking for help from others with the schoolhouse and stubbornly going on it on his own is what gives him the injury that kicks off After Story. While he gets scolded by Kanako and Tomoyo a little, it’s obvious we’re supposed to see what Tomoya’s doing as purely a good thing. How is it good to try to do something on your own when you know it might be impossible? Why didn’t you come up with a better plan with no solid way of knowing how to do it? More specifically, what compelled you to go out in the pouring rain to fix the schoolhouse, especially since he’s sometimes dealing with circuits? How is getting injured going to help anyone? Furthermore, how do we know for sure Tomo wouldn’t be better off not being confronted with this? Her mother isn’t even on board with this at first, but Tomoya stubbornly denies her point. She’s already been through a lot, why twist the knife by reuniting her with a Mother who’s going to die in the end? It’s not necessarily the wrong call but it certainly merits a more thorough consideration. It could have been somewhat salvaged if the story reprimanded him AT LEAST about going out in the rain, but it really seems to suggest that (More Tomo arc spoilers) Kanako compelled the villagers to help and Tomoya’s manly self-sacrifice was somehow responsible for inspiring them.
If the story really wanted to show the same kind of growth that he did in After Story, then change what Tomoya’s currently doing. Instead of him mindlessly working out situations on his own without a concrete plan, he should do something like enroll in cram school so he has a chance of catching up with Tomoyo in college. It’d be interesting to see a perpetual slacker like Tomoya have to brush up on his skills and try to take a college entrance exam. Having to take a job to keep up his apartment bill on top of that, and you have a that’s a lot of interesting internal conflict he can go through. You can even have him work with a brainiac like Tomoyo to help him study.That’s practical and shows he’s thinking about the future and cares about what she wants. The short-term, unpractical solution he has dealing with the gang and the way he deals with the situation in Tomo’s arc show a lack of true growth; that in admitting you need others to help you, and on your own, you can only do so much. That takes much more maturity than throwing yourself completely into tasks without considering the loved ones you cherish so much.
Now, he admitted he loved the humor and the group dynamic. But he wished the major theme was executed more logically as explained above and especially considered it odd considering all these things were mostly done by the same writer (Maeda). He feels the failure to execute this theme properly is what keeps this from reaching After Story’s quality.
I feel a number of these scenes redeem themselves by being well-written and generally hitting the right emotional beats (enough to the point I was thoroughly engrossed), but that’s really just a minor point where we differ atthis point.
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Exactly the point I wanted to make, thanks for expanding upon the subject. It must be awesome to have someone at home to discuss these things with.
I think that, more than maturing, what wanted to be exposed is how Tomoya acquires those guts and will power to keep doing it. More than starting the fights, the highlight is how he never gives up once he’s started something. In fact, (Takafumi Arc Bad Ending spoiler) If you don’t keep on fighting and Tomoyo does the job for you, you can’t do the power through choice in Takafumi’s Arc to get him to tell you what happened with him when he was in the track and field club.
However, I’m not defending by any means the fact that he should have openly told Tomoyo or asked for help anyway, but at least the perseverance message was well conveyed.
And then going to college, having a full time job, and having to pay his own rent and possibly maintaining Tomoyo up to some extent. I present you Tomoyo After: A life in crippling debt.
OK, no, but it would be a nice development, although the life changing events that defined After Story or the After Arc in Tomoyo After are difficult to create in such a situation and they would be most likely be unrelated to Tomoya dealing with college and his job.
Why would it? It’s not After Story, and the characters aren’t in the same situations or environments. The Tomoya at the start of TA is very different to the Tomoya at the start of AS, and while AS Tomoya has figures to look up to and learn from, TA Tomoya is surrounded by people with unresolved issues similar to his own. I don’t believe the story is about Tomoya’s growth as a better person, and the VN makes that obvious in multiple scenes. Tomoya is recklessly heading towards the future he wants, and Tomoyo is heading somewhere else just as recklessly… They have never, even in Clannad, understood that about each other. This guy still hasn’t talked to his dad about stuff. He’s just running from stuff he doesn’t like.
What you consider a “major theme” of the VN, in my opinion, isn’t a theme present in the VN all that often, especially in regard to Tomoya. I think you’re blurring it too much with After Story.
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Alright it’s bookclub time, let’s go.
Tomoya Arc is kind of difficult for me to nail down since it’s several things at once; it’s the prologue that’s basically inconsequential to the entire rest of the VN, it’s the common route that introduces the characters and conflicts for the first time, and it’s the first true plot and character arc of the story. Let’s take these in order.
The prologue is boring. It’s fun at times (GYAIAGREIIIIIIBODODODODOOOO) but for the most part it’s just meh. IMO the original H scenes even made more sense, and it was actually more fun to see Takafumi nonchalantly shrug off walking in on Tomoya and Tomoyo having sex than it was when she was just cos- and roleplaying. Either way if there’s one good thing about this prologue it’s that it first establishes Takafumi, and man do I like this guy. But before I get off track, let’s move on. Opening movie is A+ btw. Light Colors is great, choice of quotes is nice and the whole aesthetic just works.
Then we have the common route part of the arc, where everything is introduced for the first time but nothing is resolved yet. As far as I’m concerned this part is nothing short of wonderful. The humor is great, the soundtrack is fucking STELLAR and everything unfolds at a nice pace with no single arc or character getting an overbearing amount of screentime, and oh my god that chemistry.
For real, this group of five people right here? Has probably my favorite chemistry in any Key novel or visual novel in general. They support each other unconditionally and are completely comfortable with one another, even shrugging off being eavesdropped on like it’s nothing and being back to bantering seconds later. They just get each other. They have a bond that feels closer than even the (original) Little Busters. It’s like… they really are a small family.
It helps that we get a lot of random interactions between the group, in part thanks to minigames and Talk events. Stuff like The Panda in the Forest and The Great Detective Tomo is just plain fun and I can so easily buy that all of them readily play along and have fun doing it. I’d say I wouldn’t mind if the common route parts were longer because honestly I could watch these guys do nothing for hours and still have a great time, but the transience of their cohabitation is kind of a beautiful thing in its own. This is a group of people that ended up together through a series of coincidences and will go their separate ways in the not too distant future. But for just the short time they’re together, they’re family.
I think the group’s close relationship is why the Takafumi bad end hurts so much to read; Tomoya clearly oversteps his boundaries as he presses Takafumi on something he’s very clearly uncomfortable about and unwittingly destroys the close and trusting relationship the two share. It’s somewhat vexing that while Tomoya does get that this isn’t the way if you didn’t trigger any bad ends, there’s always the option of giving up on it and his solution is always to do exactly this. When it comes down to it, Tomoya just isn’t good at reading the mood and backing off when necessary. In fact, that’s just it, isn’t it? Rather than being capable of backing off, he’s much better at persevering. And this bad end shows you in detail how that can be an absolutely detestable thing when it’s not called for.
Speaking of persevering, let’s talk about the actual Tomoya arc. Tomoya is faced with some unexpected remains of Tomoyo’s past as a superhuman delinquent who got into fights all the time. And because he falsely projects a connection to a “stalker” he can’t let himself ignore it. Obviously the easiest way to deal with this problem is to leave it to the people who are good at handling it. Be that Tomoyo, who is still the strongest in a brawl, or even the police. But the problem extends beyond something either of those two could solve; that is that Tomoya is facing an internal crisis. This isn’t the first time Tomoyo’s past has caught up to them, and it probably won’t be the last. If he’s really her boyfriend, can he support her when that happens? We might be able to answer with a resounding “Yes, of course you can, Tomoyo can handle that much and just wants you to be there for her”, but the one asking himself that question is Tomoya, and Tomoya’s self-confidence that he’s not just holding Tomoyo back is still absolute shit.
So this becomes a self-imposed trial for Tomoya. He has to prove to himself that he’s able to solve this problem alone. It’s kinda tragic how ignorant he is in regards to how his own little quest affects Tomoyo and how he just kinda expects her to sit there and do nothing while Tomoya very obviously gets into fights but keeps her in the dark about what’s going on. But the two do share a mutual trust that’s not shaken that easily, so Tomoyo trusts Tomoya’s judgment and leaves him to his own devices. She’s gotten a little better at understanding Tomoya at the very least compared to her route in CLANNAD; she gets that interfering now would not be a good idea.
This is also where their bonds as a small family shine as Kanako goes along with Tomoya once she confirms his purpose and supports him when he actually needs it, and Takafumi too doesn’t butt in where he shouldn’t. And so, even though his methods are practically incredibly stupid, they don’t challenge Tomoya on them because they’re important to him and they get that. Also, in true street fight fashion, Tomoya earns the respect of the people he’s fighting the more he does it.
Then however comes the climax. No, not when Tomoya fights and “defeats” his last opponent; just after that. When he’s at his most vulnerable as he’s looking for Tomoyo and Tomo. Right there, Tomoya’s main goal in participating in the fights has just been completely undercut and he’s at risk of losing all the confidence he’s built up over the course of the arc. And then he finds Tomoyo and realizes that all he did was practically useless. But Tomoyo knows how hard he’s been pushing himself (even if that was more for his own sake than theirs) and gives him the acknowledgement he desperately needs. In that moment, everything he just went through gains new value. He can take pride in having done everything he could do on his own. And so he gains that self-confidence that ends up being extremely important in the next two arcs.
You probably won’t know this if you’re just playing through the game, but the 20th of June plays out quite differently if you’ve already triggered a bad end. Normally, Tomoya is the one who tells Tomoyo his thoughts on Kanako and Takafumi. If you’ve triggered a bad end already, it’s the other way round; Tomoyo has to tell Tomoya about it. It goes to show how much the boost in confidence affects Tomoya; having had that experience allows him to pay attention and focus on so many different things. Because really, he is quite a capable person once he gets over that problem. It’s just one step, and he doesn’t take the best path when it comes to making that step, but it’s an important step to take either way.
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I honestly don’t see how the story portrays Tomoya’s actions as reckless or just youthful foolishness. His actions are instead lionized as both endearing and a sign of character growth. It’s what the first arc of the story is devoted to. It even bears his name and is the reason he goes to such great lengths in future arcs to help others, so it HAS to be a good thing. At the end of his arc, he gets a peaceful ending rather than a calm reprimand. One could argue that the fact his hard work ends up being for nothing is a hint that he might have gone about things foolishly, but I believe the things he fights for passionately are a big reason Tomoyo is endeared to him (After arc) and why she does so much for him in the After arc . The route plays it up as being one of his strongest traits that while he’s not as earnestly nice as Tomoyo, he can work just as hard to help other people, and according to the narrative, in a more rational manner. I do not agree with the way that theme is realized through the story.
Also, I would disagree that Tomoya and Tomoyo are unaware of the tracts their taking in life. The reason they break up is because Tomoya is lead to believe he could never possibly have a good future, and he will only drag Tomoyo on her road to success down. Interestingly enough, Tomoya had been making subtle changes to his lifestyle (at Tomoyo’s behest) so that he could HAVE a chance of accompanying her to wherever she wanted to go. Because, in a way, Tomoyo IS a role-model for Tomoya. She has more strength and composure and initiative than he’ll ever have. This makes him feel guilty that as her boyfriend, he doesn’t compare, so he puts up with her pushiness in hopes of changing that. But her Student Council peer breaks Tomoya’s thin hopes and coerces him to make the decision he does. One could argue that the narrative ultimately agrees with this (ending spoilers) hence why he dies, ultimately saying that they CAN’T be together, but in this Memorial Edition, the ending is happy, and thus this interpretation doesn’t even apply.
Furthermore, although this is Tomoyo’s story, Tomoya is the POV character, and because this is a sequel, his character arc would naturally continue. Because Tomoyo’s ending establishes that he is willing to work hard for her sake, he would once again try to pursue her path so he DOESN’T drag her down. That’s why I conclude him going through cram school would make the most sense. That doesn’t mean he won’t suffer, fall into ruts, and maybe even fail to achieve his ideal ending, but he WOULD make a conceited effort to follow her life path. It would keep them together without her having to “go down” to his level. And what he does in Tomoyo After simply doesn’t meaningfully contribute to that goal.
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Having just finished Tomoya’s arc, not a lot I can say that hasn’t been already said!
The prologue was a terrible way to introduce the story, but I guess I can understand them for wanting to appeal to the hentai crowd and get that stuff out of the way in the beginning. It had its funny moments, but overall very disappointing.
The middle, or the ‘common route’ as people have been calling it was absolutely brilliant. All of the characters shine, there’s lots of genuinely funny and heartwarming moments, and the occasional comment from Kanako that really causes me to think. That girl has a such a negative psychology that comes out at random times. And Takafumi, I love this guy! He’s so chill with everything (that doesn’t involve his past or kissing his sister), and seems like a lot of fun to be around. I guess I’ll have more to say about him later. And Pepe summed up why Tomo is so great. Like others have said, I feel like Tomoyo is way too tsundere, but her good traits (her flaws?) definitely shine through here better than I ever felt they did in CLANNAD. Tomoya is still Tomoya, albeit a little bit more perverted.
The actual Tomoya arc portion was… Very weak for me. Having read everyone’s posts here, I can say I fully understand what they were going through, but for me, it just clashes so much with my own values. This really is a very machismo story, about Tomoya fighting to protect his male pride and gain confidence through that. It’s not exactly bad, but the reckless way he goes about it is too much for me. If the guys he were fighting were just a bit less conveniently forgiving, Tomoya could very well have died or at least ended up disabled from pushing himself so hard. The only reason is paid off was because the world (narrative) decided to be a bit kind to him and hand him that victory. It all feels very cheap to me. I know, it’s about Tomoya gaining that unyielding strength and all the awesome trust dymanics of their family unit developing, but, I can’t agree with the means. It just clashes too much with my personal values.
The music in this game is fucking amazing! Hope might be my favourite Key title screen music, but it’s gonna take time for me to say that with any kind of certainty. Some of the tracks are pretty weak, like Harmony, but overall the quality is very high. Old Summer Days is mah Natsukage of this game, really beautiful composion.
Also, don’t forget guys, Jun Maeda wasn’t the only author of this title. My main man Leo Kashida worked on it as well! Interesting thought that maybe Maeda got in some sort of brawls in his youth, but I have no reason to suspect it true yet.
Overall, 3/5. There’s some really amazing stuff in this game, but the majority of this arc felt disappointing to me. I really hope the following arcs can pick things up, because for the most part, I’m still really enjoying this title. I’m hanging out for Tomo’s arc, the drama surrounding her is really interesting to me. I find myself wondering what I would do if I were in Tomoya’s shoes, suddenly forced to protect a child I’d just met. Though, that bad end seems like it trivialises everything they’ve gone through up to this point. Can we talk about that a bit, or is this not the place?
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I see what you mean, and I totally agree with you and @DangoDaikazoku on this: that isn’t the right way to deal with these things. And there are two reasons for that:
Reason #1: As @Karifean pointed out extremely well, Tomoya needs this reassurance to his capabilities. He needs to be able to tell himself that he fought hard and did a good job. And that can only come about by doing what he feels he needs to do: protect both Tomoyo and Tomo. Granted, it is a very patriarchal way of thinking, but that is what he needs to progress as a person. And that progression is shown very well in the next arc, in my opinion. So, no, I don’t think his desire to grow would have been solved through something like going to school because, well, Tomoya simply doesn’t have the motivation for that. He has given up on that side of his life and would rather do something that directly contributes to his new family. His thinking is quite short-term rather than long-term, but if that is what he needs to grow as a person, so be it.
Reason #2: I am looking down very heavily on Tomoyo for saying this (heck I’ve been looking down on her since Clannad), but I 100% do not believe, at this point, that Tomoyo will be able to just not do anything after Tomoya tells her the situation. He was very vague about things to her, and because of that, Tomoyo was able to trust and believe in him. But if he told her the thugs were after her, do you think she’d be able to sit still and let him grow the way he needed to? I think she wouldn’t, because Tomoyo is simply just too headstrong and pushy, and thus would not realize that what she pushes for does not necessarily help other people (like the way she pushed to constantly shirk her duties in the student council just to meet with Tomoya back in clannad).
So yes, while what you say is true, and in an ideal setting, what they are doing is definitely not the best thing to do. This is because the characters are simply just too flawed as people that the idealistic answer would never work for them. Unless you prefer what happens in the bad ends after you do tell her, which, IMO, isn’t too bad after all 
Considering all the bad ends happen after the Tomoya arc, it might be better to put it off until the Takafumi arc (or at leasst just discuss it in that topic?)
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I think we’ll agree to disagree here. My saying is that Tomoyo is totally capable of that. But even if she isn’t, that doesn’t mean that Tomoya shouldn’t have told her anyway. It would have served to advance a topic explored later on in the VN: (Tomo Arc spoiler) Tomoyo’s extreme stubbornness and inability to rationally look at the consequences of any action. It’s like saying that Tomoya should have given up with the idea of building the school and hide it from everyone because Tomoyo wouldn’t have accepted it.
Growing up ad maturing also implies dealing with problems head on, not just avoiding them, which is what Tomoya keeps doing (his father, for instance). So Tomoya telling her and convincing her not to do something (minor Takafumi Arc spoiler) would have worked similarly to how he convinces Takafumi to tell him what happened in his past.
So the point I want to make in this post is that following that course of action, it wouldn’t work for them, but after some struggles, they would have learned more and overcome some of their flaws that you mentioned.
Well, Takafumi and Tomoyo are siblings. Kanako is Takafumi’s ex girlfriend, Tomoya is Tomoyo’s boyfriend and Tomo belongs to the Sakagami’s family. So I guess it would surprise me if it was otherwise.
Seriously though, the chemistry they had was great.
^ This. This arc’s purpose was to cement Tomoya’s personality and to give a certain background about why he would do some of the things he does later on.
Yeah, at this point I think that we are going to hard on Tomoya. He did what he thought that was correct. Perhaps it wasn’t the best course of action, but even then, he did it with the best of his intentions. He didn’t do it out of pure selfishness, since he kept on repeating to himself that he had to protect his family, specially Tomo. In fact, he thought that the mysterious guy behind Tomo was affiliated to the thugs, so fighting the thugs was a way to stop the mysterious guy, or at least that’s what he thought.
Well, talking about cheap, not many people made a huge remark about the mysterious guy. His existence looks like a cheap plot device necessary to give Tomoya a reason to consider doing the fighting. However, if you look closely, you can even try to extract some hidden message from there. It might be a way of saying that sometimes we worry way too much about things and become paranoid. Sometimes, we should relax a bit since we tend to lives way too stressed.
Anyway, what are your thoughts about this mysterious guy? Cheap plot device or hidden meaning?
Looks like most of what I wanted to say has been said now, but I’d like to add something that annoyed the heck out of me in this arc. You see, I believe that the most important part of being in a relationship is proper communication. But the whole conflict ends in a good note by hiding stuff from your girlfriend and doing things on your own, and while the resolution seemed to prove how dumb it was to do that, the fact that letting the girlfriend know the situation will trigger a bad end just rubbed me off the wrong way.
Of course I’d know that this isn’t the point of the route, but I still hold on to this thought.
On a side note, the prologue was amusing until it became too repetitive, the gags that followed are so darn memorable, Takafumi was cool, Tomo is kinda cute, Kanako was a bit annoying at first until she solidified her position as best girl after this route (she’s selling herself too short man), while the main couple is still unremarkable for now.
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I was wondering about the significance of the mysterious man that kept stalking Tomo as Tomoyo was taking her to school. From what I read, he was trying to get his own daughter to play with Tomo at the park where Tomo’s mother had resided before she had left Tomo all alone. Tomoya might have been paranoid since he thought the mysterious man was associated with the thugs at the dry river bed, but I want to think that he may have been overwhelming himself with so many possibilities running through his mind that he might fail in protecting Tomo and Tomoyo with someone trying to get close to them.
I think there was a deep meaning to this because it shows how Tomoya has to become strong and as he sees the man with his daughter playing with Tomo, he needs to take things slowly and not exert his mind with worries he is not able to control. There are sometimes things we are not able to control ourselves and as you mentioned we tend to stress our lives out with preoccupied thoughts and worries that can overly consume us.
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So, now I’m also done with the Tomoya arc.
Most things have indeed been already said. The Prologue was pretty weak, although still endurable and better than starting the story on some unnecessary H-scenes, at least for me. There were definitely some funny moments, like Tomoya’s “Gyaiagreiiiiiibodododooooo!!”.
The part that was called Common by most was a nice introduction to the characters, and I agree with you guys that they have great chemistry. Also, it seems that this VN is going to explore dysfunctional or outright broken families among other things. My initial impression of Tomo’s mother is actually quite different from Tomoya’s and Tomoyo’s. I think she doesn’t think that she’s able to take proper care of Tomo, probably doesn’t get enough support from familiy or friends and has such resigned in that fact. That she still cares for Tomo is already seen in her request of getting Photos of her. While that is of course sad, it is basically more or less the same thing as giving your child to adoption, something that I find way better than abandoning your child outrite.
Something else from that part:
One of those comments is the following: “Also, the families that do stay together forever grow cold.”
Having grown up in a divorced family since the age of 3 months I have no first hand experience of a couple that stays together that long, but from hearsay there definitely is a change after some time. It is usually up to the couple to always find new things in their partner, to prevent a true growing cold. There are going to be changes, but that is life. My upcoming is also a reason why this story definitely intrigues me, if my assumption on themes is correct.
And then we have the Tomoya arc proper. I also see those fights as the means for Tomoya’s selfconfidence to grow here. That didn’t really happen yet, after all. That he needs that is also seen during his work, where he said something along the lines of “Being needed by others gives me fulfillment in life.” What he still doesn’t quite know for himself is if he is someone Tomoyo can depend on.
During that part, that happened for me as well.
I am now definitely interested on how this story continues, so the Takafumi arc is next, right?
EDIT: Also, just that I understand the time at which this plays correctly, Those fights start on the 14th of July and Tomoya fights one dude per day. There are a lot of people to fight, so many in fact that Tomoya can’t really count them. The Takafumi arc starts at the 21st of July. By that time, Tomoya can’t already be over with that, so I guess I have to imagine that those fights basically happen each evening but we as readers saw all of that now for the sake of keeping the arc together. Because it neither can be that there were only like 6 dudes and Tomoya’s done by July 21st, nor can it be that a whole year has passed. Am I correct?
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Well, he never really defeated everybody. After defeating about 6 dudes, the entire gang decided it was enough and let him win. I guess that’s kind of what cheapened the effect for me :x
Ohh! Well, that indeed cheapens the whole thing. Although I guess they are right in saying he is the most determined and would fight until he’s dead. And he’d have died an utter pointless death, if it would have come that far…
I don’t know how to feel about that.
Just finished this part of TA. I didn’t take notes, so I’ll just talk about this as thoughts come to me.
Let’s start with the prologue. I had little idea what to expect with Tomoyo After, although I thought it made sense for the story to start with placing Tomoyo in every conceivable fetish possible for her. Fortunately, it seems like they did a good job writing around where the sex scene in the original used to be, although TomoyaKotori’s newfound pervertedness doesn’t help things. Still, this story feels like it could stand alone from CLANNAD so far, and that’s a big plus.
The Tomoya Arc seems to focus a lot on comedy and establishing the characters before anything else. For those who’ve read CLANNAD previously, there’s not a lot new to Kotori or Tomoyo. If anything, Tomoya is pretty much going through some of the same motions he went through in After Story, and Tomoyo is pretty much there to keep his childish behavior in check. That aside, it’s the newer characters - Takafumi, Kanako and Tomo - that makes Tomoyo After what it is.
Takafumi was mentioned and even seen at one point in Tomoyo’s route in CLANNAD, but we didn’t get much from him besides the fact that he really didn’t want his family to split apart, which caused him to throw himself in traffic. Now that he’s back to health, he’s a full-on computer nerd who hangs around Kotori’s place in the evenings, although he hasn’t forgotten how much his family means to him. This leads him to bring Tomo, his illegitimate half-sister, to Kotori’s place for him to take care of.
Tomo is an adorable little loli girl who, despite her naivete to most things, knows enough about relationships to understand that fighting is never good, and doesn’t want what happened to her mother to happen to her new ‘mama and papa’. Tomoyo takes her in immediately following Takafumi’s advice, and the three of them become a sort of dysfunctional family.
Then a piece of Takafumi’s tragic past appears in the form of Kanako. Her voice and mannerisms felt similar to Haruka from Little Busters at first, but it quickly becomes obvious that her actions are more mean-spirited in nature. Apparently she’s under the belief that true love doesn’t really exist, because her family’s in a terrible situation and Takafumi refuses to acknowledge her after her dad died. It’ll be interesting to see how Kotori proves her wrong, if it ever happens.
Anyway, the actual plot of the Tomoya Arc involves Kotori street fighting to keep Tomoyo and Tomo safe, despite the chronic injuries he receives every night as a result of the fights. It’s pretty formulaic until Kanako starts training him in self-defense, and then the fights go by quickly. I do feel that this arc spoke a lot about how determined Kotori is, but little else is accomplished for any of the other characters. I think it’s a harmless first start, and it does make me want to read more, so I’m fairly impressed.
I can only hope it gets better from here… 
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For some reason I enjoyed the scenes where Tomoya was working, learning new skills and just being useful and nice to people. It reminds me of Yukito doing a similar job in AIR, and how I enjoyed just random interactions with random people sometimes. It’s a feel-good part I suppose?
In general I really like how this isn’t just another vn that has a school setting. It’s a fresh experience, and it’s nice for it to not have to be a relatable setting that the reader can partially self-insert into, which is certainly an unfortunately common aspect to a lot of visual novels and anime. Also it’s nice to have more stories that are about life actually in a relationship.
Reiterating what @Aspirety said, the title screen music is really amazing. Not sure if it’ll become my favourite once I finish it, I’m still sometimes changing my mind on what my favourite is . A bunch of the soundtrack is pretty great too. I really like how you can tell how Key’s music has progressed, this definitely feels inbetween Clannad and Little Busters, with the types of synths and instruments they use. This also gives it it’s own charm, but then still feels kinda Clannad-y in a way.
Also I like Takafumi more than I thought I would, he just seems like a cool guy to me. Looking forwards to him having more development.
Also getting into reading this easier than I thought. Definitely gonna be able to read on time/ahead.
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IMHO, he was a cheap plot device. I’ll give props for him being a character who’s existence was referenced before this arc started, but there isn’t a compelling reason for him to creepily watch Tomo from afar. He’d probably earn Tomoyo’s favor somewhat if he flat-out explained who he was. Had he done that. Tomoya probably wouldn’t have decided to fight those thugs who he assumed were dangerous to Tomo’s welfare. I’d understand it a bit more if he’d never had children, and he was awkward about approaching a young girl at her kindergarten, but this dude has a daughter Tomo’s age. The way he exhibits his indecision is too awkward for someone who’s dealt with children on such a personal level.
@Pepe I think we have an irreconcilable difference in philosophy here. If I’m understanding you correctly, you believe self-actualization is healthy on its own merits. While I 100% agree that it’s necessary for maturity and growth, self-worth should come about through someone taking tangible steps to become more mature or responsible, or at the very least in a way that’s not callous and potentially destructive. It’d be one thing if Tomoyo was the only one at risk, and he KNOWS she could take care of this herself, but as far as he knows, a little girl is in danger. Tomoya would NEVER be so irresponsible as to disregard that, just so he can gain some self-worth points. He WOULD tell Tomoyo because this is a really important issue, and she would be a valuable asset in defending her. Tomoya is too conscientious of causing pain to other people to pull this kind of stunt.
In the first place, though, I disagree with your assumption that Tomoya is a short-term thinker. It’s long-term thinking (Clannad Tomoyo arc spoilers) that made him decide that being with Tomoyo would just tie her down. And even though you say he’s totally giving up on school, this would be FAR from the first time a character has done something they’d previously given up on in the Clannad verse. Heck, even IN THIS GAME (Takafumi arc spoilers) Takafumi takes up running again in order to resolve unfinished business . (Numerous Clannad and After Story spoilers) Yoshino takes up singing again, Sanae takes up teaching, even after giving up on her more lucrative career, Kouko decides to have her wedding, even though initially she would only do it if her younger sister recovered. Also, Tomoya himself who had given up on understanding, much less reconciling, with his father finds the will to do both in After Story, the final cause of which was also an interaction with another character. Oh, and let’s not forget him overcoming his despair and taking up being a family man again, something he hadn’t thought of doing in five years. Now, yes, each of these characters had a catalyst that spurred on their change, but Tomoya has a very obvious one here: TOMOYO. For her, Tomoya WOULD go against his comfort zone, even if that means taking school seriously again. He considers this at several points early in the VN, but his general lack of passion for life (and later plot events) keeps him from following through on it (except on Tomoyo’s and to a certain extent on Ryou’s route). Heck, he was doing this in her route before their break-up and actually had to work hard to go back into apathy mode when he pushed her away. Plus, it would shine light on a side of Tomoya we don’t see much of and see how fast he learns things. Just because its outside of his comfort zone does not mean it is beyond his reach.
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Honestly, I was not gonna read TA again since I read it only like 6 months ago but I kinda forgot a lot of things. I only really ended up reading because I got sick and listened threw down my key ost list to help me sleep and TA ost stood out to be so damn good. So anyways I’ll just briefly write down my thoughts. Most of my thoughts have already been said though.
First, I really love the character dynamic here. I think the comedy here is pretty solid, what with everyone dealing with Kanako’s bullshit and stuff. Don’t get me wrong though, I think Kanako is actually my favorite character in the entire story.
Second, Kanako speaks truth. While she does seem really pessimistic about this true everlasting love thing, it’s interesting to point out that (Full game spoilers) she asked Tomoyo something along the lines of, “Will your true love last even if Tomoya loses his memory?” (Dat foreshadow)
Welp, I don’t think my thoughts were organized at all… I think I’ll have more to say in the next arc.
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