Poll: Which of Key's works is the saddest?

Key Discussion
#63

I think CLANNAD is sad…but I think it’s just in Ushio’s part… My tear begin when Ushio say She doesn’t want to buy a newest toys…Because it’s the first time…that her papa buy a toys for her…

I vote for Little Busters…I’m really clinging into this series until now…
I can’t even decided which one is the saddest…I cried too much in this KEY works…in Kud’s route, Haruka’s route, Komari’s Route, Kanata’s route, Masato’s route, Saya’s route…until refrain…Ah…look I mention everyone…

Little Busters really have deepest meaning of life for me…How if I’m Riki? How should I do if all of my bestfriend died in that bus accident? Who should I depend on?! I don’t have parents…Now my bestfriend leave me…so it really hurt my feels…I think I will choose suicide to end this fu**ing life…But here…Riki trying to be strong and pass everything…So it really motivated me to be a better person like Riki

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#64

That scene. Right there. First time in my life that a story made me bawl that hard.

That’s what got me hooked on Key and other similar works, as well :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:

2 Likes
#65

Yo.

[quote=“EndOfRefrain, post:31, topic:811”]
As far as I know, it had like one or two kinda sad moments, but overall it’s just about how horny Kud is.
[/quote] the difference is that, unlike most Key VNs, these sad moments actually happen and don’t get magically fixed by some godly power. Also, it seems like you’ve only heard about the first half of the game; which is where all the porn is. The later half is almost entirely about story.

[quote=“Takafumi, post:34, topic:811, full:true”]
How horny Kud would be if allowed.
[/quote]id say more of "how horny can KUD be without being completely naked. Because there’s still some very sexual stuff there.

1 Like
#66

Here we go again about “Key Magic” lol. I don’t even try to understand the “what happens” in a Key VN. I just sit back and observe the emotions from the characters.

1 Like
#67

It still kills it for me when they have a great story set up, but then suddenly Key Magic happens and everything is alright. It’s like they’re limiting themselves on exploration just so they can have a happy ending.

#68

As much as I support non-happy endings, I feel that focusing too much on the plot of a Key story kind of ruins it, really. I did make a post regarding that some time ago.

#69

Did you read Tomoyo After?

#70

This is true, but I can forgive Key on the premise that they’ve made me feel so many feels that I need a happy end. I was watching through the Little Busters anime with my housemate and ‘Key Magic’ was frustrating her (whereas I had just kind of accepted it), but by the ending enough ‘magic stuff’ had happened that the secret of the world ended up making sense and she really liked it.

Though when it was too complicated for me to understand (I still don’t get CLANNAD’s ending) it kind of spoils it for me. All of the sad moments before that though still had a big impact, and a happy ending can be good to give the audience time to reflect, get them into thinking back to specific points and then the sad and happy mixes together. The last episode of Angel Beats did this extremely well and its ending is one of my favourites.

#71

[quote=“Pepe, post:67, topic:811”]
Here we go again about “Key Magic” lol. I don’t even try to understand the “what happens” in a Key VN. I just sit back and observe the emotions from the characters.
[/quote] I completely agree. If people have a complaint against so-called “Key Magic”, they need to complain to Jun Maeda, the man who gave us After Story and Refrain, because that’s how he writes. I am quite fond of his writing, and I hope he never changes how he writes.

[quote=“Pepe, post:69, topic:811”]
As much as I support non-happy endings, I feel that focusing too much on the plot of a Key story kind of ruins it, really.
[/quote]You could say that for any piece of fiction. If you take it too seriously, you end up subjecting yourself to fridge logic, which ruins your immersion and kills appeal for a fictional story. If you contemplate cliff diving instead of just doing it, you’ll talk yourself out of what could be an enjoyable experience. Don’t think, just enjoy.

1 Like
#72

My main criticism of the CLANNAD anime is that it poorly treats the ending and it’s harder for people to understand if the anime is their first look into the story.

2 Likes
#73

[quote=“Pepe, post:69, topic:811”]
As much as I support non-happy endings, I feel that focusing too much on the plot of a Key story kind of ruins it, really. I did make a post regarding that some time ago.
[/quote]It kinda “ruins” it if thinking too much about it causes you to stop enjoying it. But I’ve found many times that starting to think about what certain events/actions really mean just makes things even more valuable and emotional.

I think this is probably my favorite explanation:
(MAJOR CLANNAD SPOILERS) http://www.sankakucomplex.com/2009/03/18/clannads-storyline-explained/

The anime had the very tough job of adapting a story of which the ending/meaning relied heavily on visual novel mechanics. If you already kinda understand what is going on, or if you are able to discern all the implications that are were incredibly subtle in the anime, the the ending was done pretty darn well. Unfortunately, needing to have even a bit of prior knowledge isnt really the point of an adaptation, is it.

#74

ok, thanks. I get CLANNAD now, but it still makes absolutly no sense, but KEY MAGIC

#75

The thing about Key is they have unexplainable disease and they have magic to save the characters.

To be perfectly honest, I hated it. When I first watched AIR (my first Key series in line) I was like whaaat. What the hell is with this girl cursed or reincarnation or whatever it is. What the hell is this guy turning into crow and sh*t and such. And instead of getting tears like how people should, I was there befuddled “Where should I cry? What part is the sad one?” Though ultimately Misuzu “goal” scene made me cry.
In CLANNAD, the supernatural element is quite small in portion, so that’s why I like CLANNAD. The story is full of tragedy but it doesn’t feel like out of this world. The same thing could happen without your knowledge to someone close to you, maybe your neighbor, or your classmate, or even you (I hope not though). The VN was great but the TV anime adaptation, in the other hand, forced the magic to happen which lead to a few people disappointment. There are tons of theories but I found them really stretching it out. My opinion to enjoy the show is to forget how the magic works. It just happened. You don’t have to understand how TV works to watch it. You don’t know if it’s filled with tube, LED or tiny gremlins. They just work like that. Period.

Key magic is, I think, way too convenient. In CLANNAD TV Anime and Little Busters! the magic worked reviving the dead and I do feel like it’s not really a “strength”. Instead of doing human transmutation to revive your late mother, it’s wiser to do something else to move on. Yep, it’s sad to be left by the ones you love, but you can’t just cry all day thinking about how great if they were still alive. Such wishful thinking would lead to depression and escapism. Instead, think of “How should I go on now without them?” Find a new meaning of life, find new friends etc. You shouldn’t forget of those precious ones who left you, but you really can’t accomplish anything by thinking of them all year around.

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#76

[quote=“Hirato, post:76, topic:811”]
Instead of doing human transmutation to revive your late mother, it’s wiser to do something else to move on.
[/quote]I understood that reference. :wink:

[quote=“Hirato, post:76, topic:811”]
Yep, it’s sad to be left by the ones you love, but you can’t just cry all day thinking about how great if they were still alive. Such wishful thinking would lead to depression and escapism. Instead, think of “How should I go on now without them?” Find a new meaning of life, find new friends etc. You shouldn’t forget of those precious ones who left you, but you really can’t accomplish anything by thinking of them all year around.
[/quote] I suppose that’s one of the reasons why I feel Kanon is slightly stronger than CLANNAD. Yuuichi does cry when his friends die, but he’s shown later to have grown past it. The ‘Key Magic’ is only there to make everything feel happy and satisfying, but I still don’t mind that.

If you want a story about moving on after losing someone, you should watch Makoto Shinkai’s “Five Centimeters per Second,” not CLANNAD or Kanon.

#77

Urgh. I hate that movie. There’s nothing accomplished in the story. The animation is amazing though. (Eh, should stop talking about it. It’s getting out of topic.)

I’m not against the magic but it just felt too convenient. Which is why some part of me prefers how CLANNAD Movie ended (although the movie overall is a crapsack of adaptation).

#78

CLANNAD: Yes, if they had only taken a little bit more time to integrate and explain the balls of light and the town, it would have worked so well because it would have felt more like the magic worked for a reason

Little Busters!: …yeah…technically…sort of… but that was kinda the whole point, wasn’t it? Typically “the secret of this world” is used to refer to the “World Where Nothing Happened”, but technically the was a secret in the real world too. But I won’t go into Refrain analysis here.

#79

I think that, even with the Key magic being properly explained, it is still too hard a pill to swallow.

CLANNAD has lights that can grant any wish, in a world where everything else is normal? And you can gain multiple lights over alternate realites??? If that isn’t stretching it, then I don’t know what is

And Little Busters has people unconsciously creating a dream world that spans multiple days and repeats as much as they need? That’s just crazy talk

I think the problem with those cases of Key Magic is that there is just no sort of explanation to the mechanism. If, for example in clannad, they put in stuff like “An ancient civilization created these magical wish-granting lights. But these magical lights have been spread across multiple dimensions” then sure, I can believe it. But all that would do would be to ruin a perfectly good story.

Which is why I don’t bother understanding nor justifying the Key Magic. I just focus on the emotions

#80

Now you’re just arguing that the supernatural aspects are what’s “too convenient”, etc. All of Key’s settings are supernatural. The only difference is that with stuff like CLANNAD and Little Busters!, you don’t realize until towards the end that the setting was supernatural the whole time. Which leads to two things:

1) Shock-value and tearjerk-iness can be increased majorly with the “holy shit all that was happening the whole time and I never knew damn those characters are strong, etc.” But 2) it requires you to use your suspension of disbelief at the end, in the heat of the moment, instead of at the beginning when the setting is being built. This makes it seem more like an out-of-the-blue, “what the hell” kind of moment instead of something thats been building up the whole time.

Both of these affect each person in varying degrees, which is why some people like it more than others, and some people are bothered by it more than others.

As a side note, Angel Beats! seems to have the opposite set up, with all the supernatural stuff in the beginning, and all the real stuff hitting hardest. (From what I gather, Rewrite might be similar. I don’t really know anything about it, and I don’t want to know so don’t tell me)

#81

Some time ago, someone in this forum made a comment regarding that matter.

If someone decries “Deus Ex Machina” in a Key VN/Anime, s/he wasn’t paying attention

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#82

Yes(I’ve read every Key game at one point or another). TA had a bittersweet, but happy ending.

[quote=“Nin, post:71, topic:811”]
The last episode of Angel Beats did this extremely well and its ending is one of my favourites.
[/quote]if it wasn’t for the last 5 seconds after the credits literally ruining the entire plot for the show, I would agree. It didn’t need that at all, and it would have gone in a really cool direction without it; but nope. Key magic and all that bullcrap.